Because you can't have depths without surfaces.
Linda Grant, thinking about clothes, books and other matters.

Wednesday, 1 October 2008

What men want

Best to stay away from very sharp knives

From Giles Coren and others:

Also, I want a woman who is prepared to admit that what she wants from a man is a big c*** and a lot of money. I am fed up with women always claiming that what they find most sexy is a sense of humour. Because it isn’t true. I know this because I am hilarious. Way more funny than most of the slack-arsed, car-obsessed, office wonk baldies you’ll meet in a wine bar on a Friday night, and yet I practically never get laid. If it were true that women are turned on by a man who makes them laugh, Woody Allen wouldn’t have had to marry his own daughter.

As for a woman with a sense of humour, that’s fine, as long as it simply means that she will laugh at my jokes. Most women only laugh at their own jokes. Shut up. If you say something funny, I’ll let you know. And don’t give me “career”. Only women have “careers”. Men have jobs, to get money, and if we could stop and have babies while someone else earned the loot, believe me, we would. We don’t need a “career” to feel validated. We don’t want to feel validated. We just want to feel boobs. As many as possible. And then, at the last minute, quickly have babies and then die.


Ingrid said...

You know what I find really attractive? Guys telling me what I want.

Only really not at all.

Anonymous said...

And Giles wonders why he doesn't get laid? Hmm.


Rosaria said...

Here's the thing. One of the top reasons my man is so sexy is because when he laughs, he has an extrordinary infectious laugh that would warm the most bludgeoned heart. His eyes crinkle, his smile is genuine and generous and he has a sharp wit that never fails to amuse and excite me.

He's also tall, dark and swarthy in a terrorist kind of way...which helps...

He doesn't have much money, and I don't give a toss about that. If he was humourless, however, he wouldn't have lasted five minutes with me, because his humour is part of his optimistic approach to life.

A humourless rich bloke with a big c*** doesn't do it for me. Not. At. All.

I did not find Woody Allen even remotely amusing. Just creepy.

Men who whinge they can't get laid and claim they're freakin' hilarious - mistaking bitter sarcasm and brutal self-deprecation for humour - deserve what they get.

Which, obviously, is not a lot.

Anonymous said...

Well, Coren is in my bad books after an email of his in which he tormented his copy editors was leaked. Showed him up for what he is. A man with a small c***. (He does love those naughty words, as the leaked email showed.)


Anastasia said...

Woody Allen unfortunately stopped being funny quite some time before marrying his daughter, so he might not be a good example.
What a bitter man this Giles Coren is. No wonder he "doesn't get laid", everything he says is on the list of "What women don't want in a man".

jackie said...

waow that sounds very bitter... I think he's just not as funny as he claims to be. His remark that women only laugh at their own jokes is proof enough that in his presence the poor creatures have to resort to their own jokes to have a laugh.
And on Woody Allen, I happen to be a big fan but would never consider dating him. Writing funny dialogues and being funny/amusing in real life are two completely different things.

Toby Wollin said...

I went back to the Times article and read them all. The only positive thing in the whole lot is that a couple of the guys mention that they like women who 'like their food'. They like a woman who eats and is not fussy about it. All the rest is just..really sad, actually.

lagatta à montréal said...

Yeah, Giles comes across as a nasty little wanker.

Fortunately I've met someone much nicer, and while terribly serious at times, same warm crinkle and dry wit Rosaria admires. Not very tall, but some cm taller than me.

I am a very good cook, and find it is often appreciated. Matter of putting artistic training in the service of making friends and loved ones happy - and having the non-parent's luxury of not having to do it every evening.

I don't give a toss about a guy having money beyond the fact that he must be able to support himself - in our younger days, a lot of us in the arts make the mistake of putting our own development on hold for the sake of some self-proclaimed genius who simply has developed more self-confidence.

Anonymous said...

toby wollin wrote:

"I went back to the Times article and read them all. The only positive thing in the whole lot is that a couple of the guys mention that they like women who 'like their food'. They like a woman who eats and is not fussy about it."

But he completely ignored why women are "fussy" about food -- they're concerned about weight gain in a culture where it's bad to be overweight.

It was a bit of blaming the victim.
They really try to get you coming and going.

I skimmed the article, but Matt Rudd's struck me as funny. But maybe my standards were lowered after the first couple of submissions.

Anonymous said...

I hate criticisms, e.g., women have fussy eating habits, that don't address the underlying reasons for behavior.

Deja Pseu said...

You know what I find funny? Guys who obviously hate women, and then whine about how women don't fall all over them. (I've also found that men who complain about how "shallow" women are are invariably the ones cruising bars for "dates.")

indigo16 said...

My mother a few years back dismissed Coren as a crushing bore whose taste buds had been wrecked by a few too many recreational narcotics. I guess the damage went further than she thought.

Bronwyn said...

There is a nugget of truth in what the man says. There really are an embarrassing number of women who look on a man as a meal ticket. It is an attitude fostered by American television, e.g. Sex in the City. Most women are not that blatant, but it is surprising how many really do feel that catching a rich man so they can live in luxury is something to be desired.

I am not belittling the woman who slaves away 24/7 caring for kids and husband - I think they mostly deserve a lot more than they are ever likely to receive. And the thousands who do this while holding down a job at the same time are bloody heroines.

Elaine said...

I'll give Giles the benefit of the doubt and assume he's attempting over-the-top-jerk humor but that only works if you ultimately make yourself the butt of the joke. It's a difficult form of humor to write. If you miss the mark, as Giles did, you sound boorish, misogynistic and self-absorbed.

In defense of everyone else who was asked, "What makes an ideal woman?" should be added to the list of questions for which there's no correct answer, such as "Does this make me look fat?" and "Do you think she's pretty?"

Anonymous said...

Yes Giles is hilarous, but not in the way he imagines. Perhaps laughable would be a better description? Wanker

Bronwyn, women seeing men as a 'meal ticket' goes back a long way, to the times when women couldn't earn their own living and were barred from most jobs that paid living wages. In fact in some countries it was illegal to pay women as much as men 'til the 1970s. Men were indeed 'meal tickets'.

Although I agree popular culture is a factor, we can't blame SATC for everything. Men still earn more than women and wield more institutional power, so it's not perhaps surprising that this outlook persists.

However I can't say I think it's an epidemic. For every stereotypical 'gold digger' you'll find a number of rosarias and lagattas who are more interested in hearts, minds and human decencey that a fat wallet. Put me in that category too :)

Speaking of unrealistic expectations fuelled by popular culture, I'm always surprised at the embarrasing number of guys who think they are entitled to a supermodel-like domestic goddess who can recite the karma sutra backwards.

Bronwyn said...

Anonymous - I'm fully aware that women of my mother's generation were paid a great deal less than men. I remember equal pay legislation being enacted. I remember women fighting for equal rights and burning their bras (although I was just a couple of years too young to do so myself). I am saddened that so many young women these days take the equal rights for granted, but still feel entitled to be kept by men. The women in the sixties weren't fighting for preferential rights, they were fighting for equality.

And yes, women on average earn less than men. They will continue to do so too. Women (and I am generalising furiously here) have other priorities. Just because we have equal rights doesn't mean we have to start acting like men and working ourselves to death at the expense of our families.

Unfortunately, the main priority of a goodly number of women (in the USA especially) seems to be finding a rich man to marry.

Anonymous said...

Bronwyn we will have to agree to disagree on this because (generalising furiously myself) I don't see what you see at all.

I also can't put the pay gap down to women simply having other priorities.

greying pixie said...

Do you think there is a short period in a woman's life around early 20s when she is at her biologically most fertile when there is a tendency to look upon men as meal tickets? I remember desperately wanting a baby at that age, although I was in no position for such a responsibility. I'm sure I judged men I encountered at that time very much on the basis of how well they could maintain a family.

(Luckily the phase passed and I didn't meet my wonderful hub, a penniless artist, or have children until early 30s)

Susan said...

At least he's not bitter.

Duchesse said...

If you are funny, and a jerk, does that make you not a jerk?